Recruiting Cops Who Stay

We sit down with Marine veteran and longtime officer Banning Sweatland to map a practical path through the recruiting and retention crunch. We break down the realities of small agencies, tech-fueled pipelines, and the cultural shifts that keep great cops on the job.

• the 1990s hiring wave aging out at once
• small-agency budgets and limited recruiters
• what modern candidates expect from day one
• culture, council support, and step pay pressure
• rigorous vetting to avoid costly attrition
• empowering young officers earlier than tradition
• social media as the primary recruiting channel
• drones, helicopters, and RTCC as talent magnets
• DFR programs and 18-plus civilian pathways
• CJIS-enabled interns improving case quality
• building loyalty through relationships and transparency

Safeguard Recruiting is owned and operated by first responders, and it is a public safety recruiting firm with a proven recruiting system that staffs agencies across the country. 

Reach out today for a free consultation and learn about our guarantee that will increase the number of candidates for your agency. 

Transcript

Opening And Guest Introduction

Travis Yates 0:00

Welcome back to the show. Thank you so much for spending your time with us. We're now on all the platforms, if you didn't know. So if you don't want to watch us, you can just plug us into your favorite podcast platform and listen to the audio anytime you want. We have a lot of the back episodes on there as well. So uh spread the message. There's nobody else doing this. Uh Doug, we're getting a lot of uh a lot of people paying attention to us, but we need more because this information is gonna be powerful. So please do that. And once again, on the show, we have Doug Larson, COO, Safeguard Recruiting. It's been busy over here, Doug. How are you doing?

Doug Larsen 0:34

Doing excellent. It has been busy.

Travis Yates 0:37

Well, you're not gonna hear me and Doug much today because we have a fantastic guest on, and you probably know who he is. It's Bany Sweatland, a veteran law enforcement officer. He's got his fingers in a lot of stuff, and he more importantly, he talks to cops all over the country. And I think you're gonna love what he has to say. And Doug, I know you listen in on this conversation. Tell us your thoughts about Bany.

Doug Larsen 1:02

Yeah, guys, got he's a great influencer in the industry, and it's quite the honor to have him on here, and it's it's a great podcast.

Travis Yates 1:11

I can't wait. I haven't even done an interview already. You're not gonna be able to wait. Here it is, without further ado, Bany Sweatlin.

The 100k Cops Wave And Departures

Travis Yates 1:19

We are honored and privileged to have Bany Sweatlin on the show. He's a Marine Corps veteran and seasoned law enforcement officer with over 21 years of service. He's currently the business development officer for Mark 43. It's a RMS and a CAD system for law enforcement. But more importantly, Banning speaks to law enforcement officers and agencies across the country all the time. And we wanted to get his thoughts on recruiting, retention, and leadership. It's going to be highly valuable. Banning Sweatlin, man, how are you doing today?

Banning Sweatland 1:49

Doing fantastic, brother. Travis, I appreciate you having me on here.

Travis Yates 1:53

No, man, it's a great honor. I think we've got a lot of mutual friends. We've run around some similar circles. So it's great to finally meet you. And I can't wait to hear your thoughts.

Banning Sweatland 2:01

Absolutely, man. And uh recruitment has always been uh on the forefront of of everything that I think about. Uh definitely want to, I would love to to crack into this and and answer any questions and give you my thoughts on on anything about it.

Travis Yates 2:15

Well, I mean, I'll I'll tell you my quick thoughts. Um, it's the most important thing we can talk about or think about because if we don't recruit, there is no profession. That's right. And and do you do you, I mean, to me it's a red, it's a red alarm. I I'll just take you back a ways, Brandon, long before you were even probably thought about. But I mean, I started in '93. Uh Bill Clinton's the president. Joe Biden is the leader of the cops bill, and they put 100,000 cops on the streets. Now they sold it as community police officers, but we all lied, cheated, and stole. We took their money, uh, which gave their paid their salary for like five years. And we tested they were community police officers, but they weren't. They were crime fighting cops on the street. And putting those hundred thousand cops on the street is one of the reasons why crime was reduced to record lows in the 90s and early 2000s. And no one thought in the last 10 years, and I've been sort of raising my hand going, Do you know these 100,000 cops that you were so proud of? Well, it's 30 years later. They're all leaving the profession. Oh, at the same time, all the 2020 stuff happens. Oh, at the same time, the new generation happens. And then we all set back and we go, why is there an issue with recruiting? Should we have seen this coming, Benny?

Banning Sweatland 3:25

You know, I I see it coming, yeah.

Small Agencies And Budget Reality

Banning Sweatland 3:28

I mean, we should have forecast a little bit better, I think, than we than we have. Um, I mean, a lot of these these these smaller agencies, and I'm just diving into that just a little bit, is you know, these these agencies that I'm talking that have 10 maybe as a max for a county agency, up to 25. And if you look at the totality of the country, that's your largest segment.

Travis Yates 3:49

That's law enforcement. Yeah.

Banning Sweatland 3:50

It is, it is. I mean, of course, these big cities, I mean, some have 4,000. You know, New York's pushing 30,000. Um, you know, Dallas, I think they're sitting at four right now, but they're they're probably actually a little bit lower. Um, you know, they they had some uh upper upper management changes recently. So it's uh it's disheartening to me that we're not recruiting more like the military does. Um I know we have recruit uh uh officers for the larger agencies, and and uh, you know, I I think I believe I've even heard you in the past of this, you know, a lot it's up to a lot of chiefs sometimes when they're such a small agency uh that they have to to take their time and go out and recruit uh good officers for their department. And then with a small agency, do they have the budget to pay for them to go through the academy, or are they targeting ones that are already certified, maybe with some experience to the other? I mean, it's so much of a of a juggling act to keep. I hate to use the terminology because I I hate to hear it as warm bodies in the seat, but warm, qualified, very good at what they do bodies is a lot more important for the for the people that we serve and protect.

Travis Yates 5:00

Yeah, I mean, we we've kept the small agencies at at mind because we call them small agencies, but they're just the typical American law enforcement agency. Most agencies in America are 50 or less officers, and that's the vast majority of law enforcement. Everybody watches the news and they hear about the NYPDs and LAPDs in the world, those are few and far between. If you know, if LAPD is down 1200, that's like the typical agency being down four or five. They feel the same pressure, but unlike those large agencies, they may not have the full-time recruiters, they may not have the budget, they may not have the staffing. So they've got to get creative. And and we've we've built a system to help them and and and we do plenty of that. We have plenty of small agencies we can help. But I mean, I want mainly these agencies to understand that there's no outlying crisis where there's a lack of people that want to come to work. We just have to think differently about it, I think, because the new generation of cops, the younger generation, there's a lot of things that they're needing that maybe you and I didn't need, man. Have you seen that with the younger generation of cops?

Banning Sweatland 5:59

They are. And there's there's a ton that they're needing. You know, I go and I used to teach at one of the local academies here, a smaller

What New Recruits Expect

Banning Sweatland 6:06

academy, and uh lend my time when I had time to do that. Now, this was while I was in canine years years ago, early 2000s. And even those guys getting out at that time, so let's say 2006 to 2009 time frame, these guys were coming up to me saying, and I was currently at the city of Halton City, uh, which is a suburb for the city of Fort Worth here in North Texas. Right. We're about a hundred-man sworn apartment, which is a medium, medium to larger size department in the Metroplex. And they would immediately come to me and say, What vehicles are you running? Is the PD issuing your entire duty belt, all your uniform stuff and boots? Um, you know, am I only having to provide basically socks, undershirt, and and underwear? Um, because those are the departments that they're looking for, because they, you know, that either they've had to pay for the academy if they did it themselves, if they're lucky, they used a GI bill maybe coming out of the military. Yeah, they're really looking at not only what they're providing on the the officer's body, which is a smart thing to think about. I mean, if you're going into a long-standing career within a department, but also what equipment are they providing every police car? You know, these guys are researching it as the internet started to evolve better and better and better. Cop shows started showing more and more, and then the advent of live TV and then the investigative shows, et cetera, et cetera. These guys are educating themselves a little bit more. And people don't realize to to equip a car now for a medium-sized agency that's ordering 20, I'm sorry, for a large agency that's ordering 20 or more cars at a time to equip one car, at the very least, you're looking at $120,000 to get the minimum of what is needed out there uh to do the job day in and day out.

Travis Yates 7:49

Yeah, and not only are they expecting the equipment and resources and even the training, but they also want to they expect the culture to be right. How how vital is that? I mean, I can tell you that we've had many of clients that if we just twist the communication right and talk to them about culture and they're more inviting and more customer service oriented, that can change the whole game. Uh and so I I know I'm hearing that. I'm just curious on your thoughts as far as culture, how the department's

Culture, Politics, And Retention

Travis Yates 8:18

treating them. That's so vital, is it not?

Banning Sweatland 8:20

Well, it's you know what I what I'm hearing, and believe it or not, with my LinkedIn presence, I I get tons of, I'm gonna call them kids that are either in college or kids that are getting out of high school, possibly going in the military, but they were like I was, they wanted to be a law enforcement officer from a young age. So they're using technology to reach out to people that have that experience and trying to gather as much knowledge as they can, maybe for a placement of where they're going. And to that fact, I have a lot of contacts around the globe, even overseas, uh, that have provided me lists of maybe they have recruiters or officers that are veterans there trying to get a bonus for getting people hired or whatever, and they would kind of give me their list. So I'd had a lot of documentation that I could provide some of these young men and women that are trying to get into law enforcement, but it but it is. It's there, I I'd say a top 10 question of theirs is does the city management, city council, and citizens surround their law enforcement? Are they pushing towards their law enforcement? Or is it the latter? Are they, we need to take away from the budget. We have too much law enforcement, and they're too paramilitarized. And uh, you know, because you have, and and I I don't get into politics, but politics obviously is what breaks down the whole spectrum of law enforcement. And you're gonna have some cities that will will fully unwrap and encase their law enforcement and give them what they need, and you're gonna see their crime numbers a lot lower. And then you're gonna have ones that are oh well next year we're not gonna play for X ALPR and we're gonna get rid of that because it's too expensive. So that line item is being removed from the budget. And then the chief has to try to juggle, okay, what else are they gonna remove? Are they gonna take more of the general budget away to where our step increases don't work? I mean, that's all going to affect the recruitment. And it's all going to affect how long people are staying because they may have expected to be at a certain dollar amount for a certain amount of years before they they go into what's you know, some people call it the drop or into retirement. And and they've got to be at a certain level to where life expectancy is X age. And if they're gonna get so much a month, then were they smart about it? Did they pay off their house? So these kids, and and I applied a lot of them that are looking at finances earlier on in life, but on the flip side, and just to add to that, and the ones that are truly educated on that, I've seen them come in a department fully invest into them, and they get into their first or second phase, and they're like, no, it's not for me. And they jump ship. So is that a recruitment problem? Is it uh what's going on in the schools before they come up? That's not a big percentage, but I'm starting to see that a little bit more too, to where they see the big investment into them. But if something wasn't right, or maybe they didn't get the right training in the academy, and they're like, oh, I was definitely offended today. Uh, I was not raised like this. I'm popping smoke and going to another career. And um to me, if a department invested in me in the early 2000s, I'm going to invest back into them. And that's just how my mindset was. My father was uh an Air Force officer, and he raised me, I think, with a little bit of respect and ethics. And you know, if somebody invests into you, make sure you give that back a hundredfold.

Loyalty, Vetting, And Cost Of Attrition

Banning Sweatland 11:28

And that's what I did in my first department that I was at for so many years.

Travis Yates 11:32

Yeah, I think you mentioned something that we don't talk about much, kind of a dirty little secret, is is there's not a lot of loyalty left in the newer employees. I mean, I know when I was looking for a job at 21, it was a career. What am I gonna do for the next 20, 30 years? The kids today, the kids today, they're almost trying things out. Like it doesn't like I just know because I have college-age kids and and young adult kids, their friends, they'll hop three jobs in a year. They don't think anything of it, right? And so I think that goes into when we recruit our vetting process, right? Uh who are these individuals? What's their background? Do they have a history of being loyal, you know? And so, and I think sometimes we can get in a panic when we're maybe down on officers, we're just taking bodies, right? So, obviously, vetting and background checks, because the only really way to predict the future, as you know, banning, is to look at the past. That's really the only way. And so that's that's got to be down to a science because you're right, these departments have so much money, they're gonna spend money on it. If they lose that employee, they're losing a lot of that money, are they not?

Banning Sweatland 12:36

100%. And then is is city council going to reciprocate the next year to replace? You know, they have to look at it as a business model, and we we have to we have to look at things as a business model. Everybody's like, oh, I I went into law enforcement to run a police department, it's run is different than running a business. It absolutely is not, it is it is running a business.

Travis Yates 12:57

The only difference is is is is all the times our leaders say we got to spend all the money by the end of the year so we can get the same amount of money. Well, that's not how a true business would operate, right? But we we sometimes think so.

Banning Sweatland 13:06

Chiefs have really got to have their immediate command below them, ready to take his or her spot at any time. So he needs to be lifting uh the guys and girls just underneath him to know just as much, if not more. And I believe that's a true leader. And that extends down even to the to the captains, the lieutenants, the sergeants, the corporals, your senior police officers, deputies, what have you out there. If you're a chief up there and you're just sitting on what's called the throne, and you've got that closed door, and you're basically only in tune to what's the city manager telling me, what's city council, are we upsetting the public out there, are we making them happy? You're not doing justice to your citizens. You've got to be out there engaged. I don't care if you've got 15,000 officers, you've got to up rear end out of your seat from time to time, get back out in the field. If you have a real-time crime center, you got to get in there and find out are the do they have the proper stuff. Have you sat at one of those consoles to see what those real-time crime center operators have done? Same with dispatch, same with

Empowerment Over Seniority

Banning Sweatland 14:12

the guys that may be out there serving civil process because it's a complete different, you know. To be the head of that agency, you've got to understand the true workings within that agency. Um, and we've got to stop promoting within some of these agencies to end a problem. And I think you know what I mean by that. You have some of these civil service agencies out there that may have a problem person, and the chief's not even aware of it, but these lower lower echelon guys may be promoting somebody to a corporal or sergeant so they can kind of position them at an office and they know that that's going to end the problem, maybe what they have on the street, instead of addressing in the training. We've got so many amazing agencies out there that are doing it right. Reach out to your neighboring agencies and find out how they're doing it, how they're doing the retention and how they're doing their training. Uh, I know I kind of skipped all over the the baseball field there, but there's so much within to get that retention and get that want for people to want to come in the door and ask for an application.

Travis Yates 15:06

Well, I'm sort of a geek when it comes to a lot of these uh employee studies and retention studies, and I've been reading them for years, and of course, with safeguard recruiting, we're we we we read them all the time. But I tell you a little dirty secret that if we want to talk about it is you talk about, and you just mentioned it, empowerment, not only empowering your middle management banning, but man, if you hire a kid, the kids expect to make a difference, they expect to have a role in the decision making. The worst thing you can do is what they did to me and you. Shut up for five years. If we want you, we'll talk to you. No, no, you better day one offer these young officers the opportunity to do some pretty cool things, or they'll just go to the next place. They have no bones about it.

Banning Sweatland 15:46

Absolutely. I mean, when you and you and I were were hot and popping, you know, and I it just to give you clarity, you know, I I got in, I started in 2002. You know, I got out of the military just right right before 9-11 happened for like a month. So I got in, I got into the uh in the law enforcement right after that. And my whole job when I got hired at the larger agent, my first larger agency, was be quiet, yeah, listen to your FTO, and then once you get released from that, be quiet. You have veterans on your shift, they're gonna be picking on what shift they when shift assignments come down. You haven't earned your status yet. And we just got off a hiring freeze. So when I was hired, it was a couple years before they even hired one more.

Travis Yates 16:27

So I was always the you were quiet for a while.

Banning Sweatland 16:30

So I was quiet, but I was going out there and I'm like, you know what? I could be quiet in the briefing room, but I can go out there and kick butt out on the street with the knowledge and abilities that I've been taught. And uh I don't think they're gonna calm me down from that. And they didn't. Um, and that's eventually what led me into my canine role at a very early age, uh, which also put a big target on my back from other people that I've worked with. Jokingly, not jokingly speaking of when you get selected for a b-billet uh specialized role at less than two years at a department when the minimum was five within the the general orders, and the uh the chief at the time changed

Social Media And Smart Recruiting

Banning Sweatland 17:08

it because he he he saw something. Um anyway, I I was ultimately selected from an interior and exterior board, and I got selected for that. And then my phone went silent from my from my workmates. Um I was getting more calls from the from the city of Fort Worth and Hearst and other agencies, you know, all the way to Waco and as west as Abilene to go assist with narcotics and tracking than I was my own agency until I proved myself. And I get it. There were some veterans that wanted that position, they felt that they had gotten there, but I'm glad that my agency used an internal and external board to have some more weighing in on uh on who got that role. And I, to be honest with you, I did not expect to get that role. I put my name in the hat and uh I got a lot of booze out of it, but went through that two-week process and ended up getting it. And that really raised my morale as a young officer that I wanted to push it forward that much more.

Travis Yates 18:01

Yeah, and it's really just a a shift from old thinking and tradition. I mean, I I love that on one side I love the traditional law enforcement, on the other side it's holding us back, right? And uh we we can't keep recruiting or treating people the way we got away with for so long. But quite frankly, when you hired and I hired on, we could get away with that because there were plenty of people trying to get our spot. You know, there were you know, I think I tested with a thousand people for a few spots, you know, those days are over. You've got to maximize that, and you want to get high quality people, but to get to high quality people, you've got to treat people like they're high quality, do you not?

Banning Sweatland 18:39

Sure, absolutely. And I've been invited to let's just say a lot of Texas agencies when they do a uh civil service test, you know, they do the announcement in the paper, social media, and we can come back to the social media because I think that is so important. Um and they and they're doing that, and they're and they're getting, you know, they've they've got 500 seats available, and now I'm seeing them maybe fill 250 of those. Um and and then you look at the the the real deal, they're they're trying to get 50 spots in some of these middle to larger agencies. Uh but what's sad to me is is and I and I love every uh young man, young woman that comes in and applies themselves and to do that, but I want them to remember you're coming into a law enforcement agency and they may or may not run you while you're in there doing that test. And I have seen about 10 to 15 people hooked up for uh low-class traffic warrants coming in to test for a law enforcement agency. And that kind of blows my mind. Either is the agency not explaining things well, or do we have an audience that's seeing this now thinking, well, I can just let that go. My responsibility is go, because I'm gonna go out there and and uh serve and protect and enforce the law, and that'll just go away. I'm just that was, you know, I I never know what to think when I see people getting arrested out of law enforcement testing for them to go to the academy or to be hired. Uh people getting arrested out of there. I mean, that just kind of blew my mind, and I've been to several.

Tech Draw: Helicopters, Drones, RTCC

Banning Sweatland 20:12

Um, but I love the fact that people are coming and you have to weed that out, and obviously that's part of your background and everything. You don't want anybody with the traffic and stuff like that, but just meeting on the people on their own notion before they go in to do this. Applaud for coming in. However, take care of the stuff before you before you come in and apply at a at a law enforcement basis.

Travis Yates 20:32

Yeah, and you mentioned social media, and and and we're big fans of you've gotta, if you're going to recruit, you've got to go where the people are, and they're all on social media. I, you know, listen, I'm not gonna bad mouth, you know, job fairs and all this stuff we used to do back in the day. If you want to waste your money and do that, waste it. But everyone's on social media. 85% of all job applications come from mobile devices. You know, that's where people are living and breathing each and every day. And so obviously, we source candidates for agencies through social media and we encourage departments to do the same. You know, they don't have to hire us to do the same thing, but because there's some things that work, some things that don't work. And you're out there on social media, Band, and you have one of the highest profiles out there. I mean, what are you seeing that you really like that agencies are doing?

Banning Sweatland 21:15

When when Agencies are up front, you know, I see some chairs out there that'll that'll show when they get a whole new fleet of vehicles or they add a new, if they're lucky enough to have a friggin' air unit, an actual helicopter. You know, that's you know, back when you and I are were in, and and especially in the 90s, there was a lot of helicopter support out there, more than I see. I mean, I see a lot of helicopter support. And when you get closer to a metropolitan multiple millions and millions of people, you know, you'll have a couple helicopters available to law enforcement. I understand that that drones are kind of taking over, it's saving some people money. Um but something with a with a a peace officer that's sitting up in a multi million dollar helicopter with a FLIR system that has done what the units have done on the ground. Guiding their guys in. I understand they can do that with drones now as well, and the flight times are getting longer. I'm a drone pilot. I love drones. But also of what the factor does to the suspect that just bailed out of a stolen car, then he did a gunpoint, and now you've got, you know, Los Angeles Air One overhead, lighting them up with a two million candle power spotlight, and then they got FLIER, just goes towards that police force. Drones are amazing. But when you want to come out and show force and you've got the helicopter up in the air, uh says something else, and the helicopters can really stick uh with these guys on the ground and less accidents to the public when the helicopter can follow at a safe distance a lot longer to a drone and at a much higher rate of speed if needed. Uh I've been up in those helicopters with these guys on some of these large agencies, and they're just impressive. I've been at real-time crime centers watching these drone pilots equally as impressive. This technology is amazing. And I know some of these people are entering law enforcement now in hopes to get their part 107 for that drone and eventually go sit in a real-time crime center or have a drone attached on the top of their unit or deployable from the back of their unit somehow, uh, because that's their love. And and that love follows their law enforcement love. And this technology is going light years beyond from when you and I first started in this profession.

Travis Yates 23:24

Yeah, I used to manage uh a helicopter unit, and I'll tell you it never got old, man. Like I'm I was 45 years old looking at this thing like it was the best toy in the

DFR Programs And Youth Pipelines

Travis Yates 23:35

world. You know, it was Christmas every day when I was had involvement with that unit, and yeah, it was $10 million a year, you know, we were spending. But man, I tell you what, you don't you just park that thing and you can recruit all you want. But it is interesting what you say. Leveraging those cool toys, leveraging drones, leveraging technology, that is opening up a space to new officers that may not have even thought about law enforcement. We've got a client that they're I mean, we haven't launched yet, but their whole campaign is revolving around their drone program, and it's I think it's gonna be very successful. So, kind of give us your thoughts on that because uh it's interesting you mentioned that because we think of the military people and law and order and let's catch bad guys, but then you have a whole segment of kids coming out of school that are they're technology people, and you could if you can mesh their love with the job, they're coming.

Banning Sweatland 24:25

Absolutely, and I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of bounce around the country at a couple different places. You you have uh, and I'm sure you're familiar with it, but Arizona, you know, you just have to be 18 years old to be hired in the real-time crime center as a civilian. So you can come in, uh, I'll give you an example, Scottsdale Police Department, because I know those guys, they're they're amazing guys. They will hire uh a kid. I I think they even do part-time, and I'll have to get with the supervisor to find out. They'll do a part-time program and assist with the uh part 107 on the drone. But they can actually deploy a drone from the real-time crime center, go out and assist the police department as an 18-year-old kid after the proper training. That was not available to any nothing like that.

Travis Yates 25:11

No, no, we're we're we're trying to work in some smelly jail as an 18-year-old.

Banning Sweatland 25:16

Oh, absolutely. And it's uh a jail, or you know, with me, I wanted to uh uh go serve the country how I could and and get some extra training from that gap to 18 to 21. Yeah, uh, you know, I went and took a couple college tests and uh it wasn't in my future. But being a jar head in the Marines, I did very well on the ASVAD test, and that's not to say a lot for Marines as a little uh punch humor. You know, they gave me my box of crayons, gave me some training.

Travis Yates 25:45

Well, listen, I grew up with the Marines, so you're not gonna hear me bad about the Marine. He'll come over to my house tomorrow and take care of it still.

Banning Sweatland 25:51

So yes, yeah. And it's uh but but to get the training that I received and uh some of the CQB stuff and and the fast team guys that were that you know that we got to train with uh being security forces in the Marines was was amazing. And to take that training and kind of blend it uh within the law enforcement training that I received was was awesome. Yeah, I still use some of that training today. Well is some of the patrol tactics a little bit different now? Yes, but I adapt and make sure I I

Interns, CJIS Access, And Case Quality

Banning Sweatland 26:20

stay ahead of the game on that if I'm teaching somebody else. So, but but going back to that the drone program and and and a chief and city kind of wrap it around the recruitment around that, the DFR program, which is a great program, is is smart in a couple segments because they may get to learn about drones as a civilian employee and get a much higher love for law enforcement, and they're already vetted within that company. They've got a clean record, they've had them since they were 18. Once they turn 21, they may want to make an investment in them to become an officer. And you know, then they can be do that DFR program from a from a law enforcement vehicle or come back maybe as a supervisor.

Travis Yates 26:58

Well, I listen, I've always thought the low-hanging fruit for agencies is uh have a city jail or county jail, your veting them there, hire them as civilian data entry people, uh, real-time crime center, any jobs you have that you can hire. You know, that that's just easy vetting, easy background stuff. And and and I love re I love at the point of coming out of high school, we're trying to hire people. And most departments have roles for that. I'll tell you, when I was 19, I was working in a police department. Yeah, I was washing police cars and and running errands for the chief. You know, it was a little college program they had, but that was it was designed. They hired four people at a time, and it was designed to let's just get our eyes on these four people and see if maybe one of them can be in law enforcement. Absolutely.

Banning Sweatland 27:44

And that's and that's smart. And you know, they have different programs now. And and if we how long has the military been doing recruiters in each large cities and then satellite offices right in high schools, they walking right into high school. They they come in during career days, they're coming in because they know that the age is 18, and a lot of these kids aren't like me, weren't cut out or didn't even have the money for college. I'm darn sure not going to get a full ride. Uh, and and then they offer that hey, you can get college while you're with us, while you're serving the country.

Travis Yates 28:15

Well, banning uh banning, we we built a whole program around what the military did. So we have a program where, yeah, departments, you can run ads for your openings, but how about you run ads for senior in high school? You grab their information, you know their age, and you put them in a nurturing campaign, communication campaign, you keep up with them, you get to know them. That's your future employees. Now, to be honest, most agencies don't have the either the ideology or the budget to do that. They're just like we are panicking, we got to hire now. We can't think about that. But really, those relationships, that's why we have DARE officers and officers in schools, and that's just as much of a recruiting tool than whatever silly program we may be teaching some 14-year-old, right?

Banning Sweatland 28:56

And and I actually just want to remind chiefs that then they watch this or or or uh professional standards or internal affairs guys, sometimes they get slated for

Relationships, Transparency, And Public Trust

Banning Sweatland 29:05

for hiring folks. And um, when you're 18, you can get CGIS uh certified. You know, so why not have an intern program? If these kids are going to a local college, have an intern program, get them completely CJIS certified where they're coming in, and maybe helping you file cases, maybe helping you uh watching body camera stuff. Because if as long as you have that CJ certification and the blessing from the chief, you can get these guys and gals in it at such a young age, like we're talking about, and even doing different things and watching the cars, just teaching the discipline of we got to keep our equipment clean, working, uh uh to be able to operate for these officers. And why not send them out there on range day? Let's do some brass ball.

Travis Yates 29:46

Well, think of the disadvantage banning. So military can take them at 18, most fire departments are taking them at 18. And then uh for me, I was trying to be a trooper, and they're like, You got to be 25. And I'm like, What? I'm never making it a 25, brother. I'm gone. So I certainly I so I didn't become a trooper. So I I've seen some departments kind of lowering some of those ages and kind of doing some of this, but you think about all of the non-police work that police do, look at investigations. How much of that could you an 18-year-old kid type away and do data entry and all that stuff? So I think it's something to think about. Um, it's certainly going to be much beneficial on retention if you already had them in your agency for a couple of years before you actually make them sworn.

Banning Sweatland 30:25

Sure. And even, you know, if they're CJ certified and they and they've got, and I'm talking about people that go through the pike almost as much as police officers, but what if they're just reading those narratives coming in? Yeah. They're an English major at their local college and they're just reading those friggin' narratives coming across, and kind of like a peer-to-peer, you're gonna have a lot of young officers out there that are stroking out a lot of reports for their thing it's over with. And we have new programs out there that are doing AI generation, and that's all fine and good. But your arrest and your report are only good as your narrative written. And that narrative is so important. And while he's reading these, he's learning elements of the offense. Yeah, he's learning probable cause, what you know, how how to articulate reasonable suspicion based on reading all these stories that are coming through with them. Give them those stories and look at the body camera footage. Obviously, we're careful with what ones that we're we're having them watch, but just for learning, they're reading and they're like, Well, this happened in the video. Why isn't it mentioned here? I thought you guys said if it wasn't written, it didn't happen. And, you know, through discovery, does that need to be put onto that narrative? Does that also need to go in and supplement this young kid, 18, 19-year-old kid, catch that and help that case? Is that suspect now going to actually maybe serve some prison time? Because we got a motivated kid in there helping these officers. And then are we going to mold him to where he applies with us to be a police officer when he's 21 and now he's got an associate's or a bachelor's, even better? Or maybe you decided uh college wasn't for him, it didn't quite finish, but now he's 21. And for our department, we don't need that. Let's sponsor him and send him to the police academy. He's showing, you know, I mean there's so many ways to skin the skin the cabin out.

Travis Yates 32:04

Well, and and the the revolving theme is relationships, right? Form relationships, get to know people, it's going to do wonders.

Banning Sweatland 32:10

Absolutely. Absolutely. And, you know, and just these, you know, I've seen some agencies kind of turn down writers um from the public. And I've seen them,

Closing And How To Reach Banning

Banning Sweatland 32:20

you know, with the whole First Amendment craze going across the country, the these guys with cameras and and you know, our our podcast called Two Cops, One Donut, not to put that out there, but we Everyone's heard of it.

Travis Yates 32:30

What are you talking about, Banning? You don't have to put it on it. Everyone knows it.

Banning Sweatland 32:33

We uh we we we put on body camera footage from all over the country. Yeah, and we're not targeting departments, we get the stuff that's just it's it's available on YouTube. Um and we just well, sometimes we'll have just myself and Eric Levine in there, or we'll bring in other experienced officers or even guys from force science like Von Kleen, uh, these these guys that really know what they're doing in officer involved showing.

Travis Yates 32:55

Well, Vaughn's been on this show. Vaughn's been on this show. We know Vaughn well, yeah.

Banning Sweatland 32:58

Vaughn is a great guy. Yeah, and uh, and to have him on there, uh, because our audience on Two Cops One Donut is your general public and lawn. Yeah, it's it's the melting pot. It's not just cops. We're not this echo chamber of uh blue line this, blue line that. We're we're bridging the gap between the community and law enforcement and trying to bring that uh cohesiveness and bring the uh togetherness back uh the way it should be. And we're we're chipping away at it, man, and we're doing we're doing a good job. And we've had a lot of naysayers when we first started this venture that are now donating to the show, you know, buying whatever member. I don't even know Eric knows how all that stuff works, but they're they're they're paying for other people's memberships to come and and and and and to watch our show every Monday night. And it's great, man, to see these people that may have had a bad run in with law enforcement eventually get turned around and and and kind of flip that leaf over uh for everybody that's involved, which is which is amazing.

Travis Yates 33:54

So great stuff, Banning. Banning Sweatlin. Before we get off here, man, how can they reach out to you? I know you're a busy guy, but you're what I love about you is you're always open for everybody to reach out to you and you talk back to every single person. So let's put that information out there for people.

Banning Sweatland 34:08

Absolutely. I mean, you reach out to me directly. The best thing to use is LinkedIn. Uh just LinkedIn under Banning Sweatlin. I I I get, you know, when I put content out, I'll get a couple hundred messages on there a day that I I go through. I wait till I'm done with my work day. You know, I've got an employer that pays me. Once I get done with that, I'm sitting down doing dinner with the family. Once that's done, I'm I'm in my LinkedIn and I'm going through it. I'm getting back to each and every person. Um, even ones that tell me that I have uh relatives overseas and I've won a million dollars. Joking. Uh I get back to everybody. Um, but people have so many amazing questions. And since I've been on LinkedIn since 2018, 2019, somewhere in there, uh, I've followed the journey of over a hundred young men and women that have got into the field of law enforcement and are now successful in that field. So please keep the questions coming to me. Uh, hopefully, I can direct a lot of these folks to you. Hopefully, I can direct departments to you for what you guys are doing because we've got to get our recruitment a lot better.

Travis Yates 35:10

It's it's everything, man. That's why I'm fully committed. That's why we've got over 100 years of law enforcement experience in the company because we talk the talk, and and yeah, it's a business, Manny. But at the end of the day, uh it's for my kids and your kids. It's for the future. We want fully staffed agencies. So, man, I can't thank you enough for what you do. We're gonna have you back. I can't wait to have you back. I mean, I'd hate to even cut this conversation short. It's so fascinating, but thank you for being here. And if you've been watching or you've been listening, thank you for being here, and we'll see you next week.